Everybody's doing it! A poll.

[mrsronweasley]

So, this is something that's kind of interested me for a while, and now I'm sitting here, enjoying my newly-fast computer (oh yeah, my external hard drive came yesterday, and WHEEE MORE SPACE), and wondering:

How do people feel about kid!fic?

I know that in HP, I absolutely loathed it. Even though both Remus and Sirius appear to be good with kids, I could never, ever stomach them adopting/trying to raise a kid, and mpreg? FORGET ABOUT IT. (This is still the case, by the way, just in case you were wondering.)

Then, I came to due South. And then, I read 'With Six You Get Eggroll'. And, okay. The premise struck me as completely improbable, and I almost didn't read it. I mean, really, come ON: Ray and Fraser, raising SIX CHILDREN? WTF? What is this, "Sound of Music"?

But then I did read it, and completely fell in love with it. Because it strangely works and it's sweet and it just...it WORKS.

And then, there's Ray Kowalski, who, in canon, wanted kids, and in fact, this was probably the chief cause of his divorce. And I thought more about Ray and realized that he would have made a wonderful dad. Crazy, yeah. Overprotective? Yeah. Sometimes embarrassing? Sure! But he'd be CRAZY about his kids, and he'd have fun with them and know what to do when things wouldn't go well.

So, then I started searching for more kid!fic. And I was kind of lost.

And THEN, I SOMEHOW - *points accusing fingers at katrin and rhythmsextion* - got suckered into writing kid!fic. So, okay, it's an AU. But still. Here I am, writing it. (And yeah, Kat, I still am. In fact, it's been revived! Much to my surprise.)

So, I guess that sums up my history with kid!fic. I just never thought I'd have it in me to enjoy it, and now, I...really really do. It's Ray, it really is. He tugs at my strings and pushes all my (known and unknown) buttons.

Now, it's your turn. Tell me:

[Poll #727036]

Comments

[pearl-o.livejournal.com]

See, there's the Ray stuff you talk about here? But then Fraser, too, it works for! Because he's ALL ABOUT pining for faaaaaaaaaaamily, you know?

I remember somebody -- Shrift, maybe? -- saying ages and ages ago how F/K is really just about the only slash OTP where you really can just picture them going that way.

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

That is so very, very true. And in many ways, they're the two people who complement each other enough to make really good parents. They both have issues, but they have what it takes, I think.

And Fraser! Very very true. He wants a family, and I really liked the part in "Eggroll" when he talks to Stella about wanting noise. I can really see that.

Aww... *pets them both*

[doctoraicha.livejournal.com]

There seems to be an assumption in your post that kid!fic has to be slash fic. So, for me the thing is Kid!fic seems so acceptanle in hetero but not homo situations. But for me, if it's heteropeople OR homopeople that I can SEE - like Ray - would like to have kids, I can handle it. Otherwise, no thanks. It's all about characterization. I mean, I think Harry would want kids, and I think I like reading H/G where they have kids. I am not sure about either Remus OR Sirius wanting kids, and since that couple is dead, given, you know, one of them is dead and the other has moved on, then I don't really want to read kid!fic with them. On the whole, though, MPREG is stupid. I don't like fic in which things that are anatomically impossible happen. Poorly written sex, for example. Or MPREG.

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

You know what's really funny? I didn't even think about het... I... haven't read het in - I'm not kidding - years. Ummm. Huh. Well! I probably should have clarified the slash part.

But I totally agree - it's all about characterization. H/G? Totally! Harry might want a big family, because he never had that, and Ginny - well, that's what she knows. That makes sense, you know? Remus and Sirius, even if they'd survived, I can't really see that.

And Mpreg is just AWFUL. Come on, people. You're trying WAY, WAY too hard. It's just creepy.

[bluebrocade.livejournal.com]

I can get into DS kid!fic under the right circumstances, like Eggroll. In SGA, I'm all over the kid!fic and mpreg (which is, I realize, I different issue altogether). Yet, in The Sentinel -- I just can't buy kid!fic under any circumstances. Weird. It definitely depends on the fandom.

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

Yeah, what I've seen of TS...it would be weird, wouldn't it? I can kind of, maybe, see it in SGA, but only because Vonnie's been so persistent in trying to get me to read it. *g* She's so cute. So, yeah - under the right circumstances is how I see it too. :)

[terredancer.livejournal.com]

Okay, kid!fic.

I'm actually okay with it as long as certain conditions are met. Characterization, natch. No mpreg, since that makes my eyes bug out and go WTF?! Good writing... well, that's just it.

Good writing will take me where I wouldn't otherwise go.

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

Yep, ditto, ditto, ditto. A good writer can take you a LOOOOOOOOOONG way. *g*

[malnpudl.livejournal.com]

Usually I dislike kidfic; I generally won't read it. In fact, I resisted reading "Eggroll" for the longest time, just because of that. (Silly me. Now it's one of my all-time favorite stories in the fandom.)

It's all about characterization. You've got to sell me, and I'm a hard sell, but I can go there. Sometimes. In some fandoms and pairings. If the writer's really good.

But I'll never go out of my way for it.

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

("Eggroll" is special, isn't it? It just...gets under your skin, in wonderful ways. GOD, I love that story.)

You've got to sell me, and I'm a hard sell, but I can go there.

I totally get that. I was like that with AUs, actually. Still am, in fact, since even the most interesting of premises I will drop like a hot potato if the writing sucks. In the end, it really is about the writing - but that's true of anything in fanfic, isn't it?

[rhythmsextion]

I, for one (and I'm betting Kat's with one this as well) am SO fucking glad to be glared at right there. I'm still anxiously awaiting that fic. Just so you know. And normally, I'm not one with the kid!fic. In fact, I'm not even a huge fan of With Six You Get Eggroll. Huh.

[helleboredoll.livejournal.com]

HEE!! ICON FREAKIN' LUVRE!!!

[drlense.livejournal.com]

It's a deep shame, but I adore kidfic. I have read some of the smarmiest, worst stories because there were kids in them. It's a terrible, terrible affliction.

[queenriley.livejournal.com]

OMG luffs your icon.

*pets the icon*

[isiscolo.livejournal.com]

See, my problem with kidfic is that I am not really a fan of kids. I don't have any, never wanted any, find them occasionally charming up to a point but am happy to hand them back to their parents after a short time. I am not really interested in parenting issues. So I'm not too interested in reading stories that focus on them.

This doesn't mean I never read kidfic. But the bar is higher for those stories to interest me.

[shayheyred.livejournal.com]

We were separated at birth.

[croupier.livejournal.com]

I don't give a fuck. If it's good, it's good; if it's bad, it's bad, just like everything else.

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

Understood! *g*

[queenriley.livejournal.com]

The only way I take my HP kid!fic is if it's far far in the future and it's Ron and Hermione's kids or Harry and Ginny's kids... or Nevile and somebody else's kids. And it has to be well written.

I don't read most kid!fic because mostly it's just improbable in the fandoms I'm in. Buffy? Yeah, kid!fic wouldn't work. At all. HP? Like I said, only in the far distant future, and definately NOT with Remus/Sirius. SGA? Well...

Okay, so that's my weak spot. I can't pass up a fic where any of the group is either a)turned into a kid or b)left with a kid temporarily or permanently. I do NOT do mpreg, though I did read a fantastic Stargate: Atlantis John/Rodney fic where they both touched an ancient device that combined their DNA and made a baby... essentially a test tube baby. :D It was cute. I'm a sucker for it, what can I say?

Though I have a major stipulation. The kid has to be believable as a kid. I hate hate hate reading fics where 5 year olds act like 2 year olds or 10 year olds, or 3 month old babies are acting like 12 month old babies, or anything like that. Kids must act emotionally and intellectually developed appropriately for the age the child is set at. The intellectually I'll push a little if it's Rodney's kid because hey, super genius likely to have a pretty smart kid... though I don't buy the 5 year old doing complicated physics thing... just smarter than the average 5 year old.

And for the love of all that is good in this world, NO MPREG! I hate it. Despise it. Will not ever ever ever ever ever read it. No way, no how, not by any author out there. JK Rowling herself could write MPREG and I wouldn't read it. :P

[airinshaw.livejournal.com]

Stargate: Atlantis John/Rodney fic where they both touched an ancient device that combined their DNA and made a baby...

A Beautiful Lifetime Event. One of the greatest fics ever. Definite proof that kid!fic depends on the writer and/or fandom.

[alpheratz.livejournal.com]

I guess the best way I can describe it is that it's not a squick? Eh. I read it fairly often, and often find it enjoyable, but if I had a list of my favourite fanfic plots/cliches, it wouldn't be on it. I like guys who are good with kids plenty in real life, but in fiction, the fathering aspect doesn't push my buttons.

And of course, there's characterisation of kids themselves. I'm a little tired of the mini-adults with amazing powers of snark and manipulation (...I read way too much SGA kidfic). It can be really cute, but, just, I've never met a kid like that, you know?

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

I guess the best way I can describe it is that it's not a squick?

laskdkasd;laksd
dlaskd;akd

Hey, that's a plus!

I like guys who are good with kids plenty in real life, but in fiction, the fathering aspect doesn't push my buttons.

Totally valid lifestyle choice. :) It really is a very personal thing, isn't it? I never expected to enjoy it, but with dS, I really really do. It's very weird.

And yeah, please make the kids believable, people. There are a lot of films and TV shows that totally fail at this, as well. Drives me NUTS.

[soupytwist.livejournal.com]

I do like you randomly talking about stuff. :)

With me, it totally depends on whether the kid-fic seems to be there for the kids or the adults. If the point is the kids, if they're who the story's about, then I 99.99% of the time hate it. (I say that because I read one once that was all about the kid that I LOVED... only now I think about it the kid in that one canonically existed, except in a very different, er, form, so maybe that doesn't quite violate the rule...) If the story's about the adults, then it depends on the story, whether the situation makes sense and whatever. I have no interest in reading about overly cute and perfect children, but a good story that happens to have kids in it I can like just fine. And actually, now I think of it, good kidfic is often exceptionally good, because the people who have the necessary writerly skills to make it not suck are often amazing. So my usual "eh"-ness about kidfic becomes an advantage, because I'm so impressed they managed to pull off something difficult.

Um, if that makes sense...

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

I like you randomly talking about stuff, too! In fact, the other night, I totally rewatched "Asylum" because you talked about it, you pimp, you. *g*

I have no interest in reading about overly cute and perfect children, but a good story that happens to have kids in it I can like just fine.

I can totally see that. And overly cute and perfect children make me GAG. In fiction, and mostly in real life, maybe? *g*

So my usual "eh"-ness about kidfic becomes an advantage, because I'm so impressed they managed to pull off something difficult.

Ha! I never thought of it that way. That's really kind of funny.

It makes perfect sense, Wifey, darling. MWAAAAAAAH!

[cabari.livejournal.com]

The kids have to be written well. And, of course, the adults, but I hate with a fucking PASSION smarmy, precocious, perfect wee little adults in kid's bodies. Of course I also hate the OMG REBELLING I HATE YOU PARENTS!!!! kids too. There's a medium, and it has to be reached, and there's a million ways to do it, but everyone seems to gravitate to extremes.

Also it has to be believable. With Ray/Fraser, yes, it's just about inevitable that they would have kids, one way or the other. But with other pairings, it's just... no. And the REACTION to the kids has to fit. I read the most wonderful X-Men kidfic once, with Beast having a little girl, and it was charming and good and nice and yay, but the way he intellectualized everything, and paniced in his calm sort of way, that's what made it.

So, if it's good, then it's good. If it's not, then it's fucking awful. And I don't even like kids.

[cabari.livejournal.com]

PS, I don't think I told you lately how much I love you. Sometimes I just think about you, and it's like, "Aw! Liz!" and it makes me happy.

[katrin.livejournal.com]

I love kid!fic; I do. I can't help it. As long as it's about two people I can see as parents? Bring it the hell on. Also: YAYE.

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

Well...exactly! If the people are just not fit to be parents and it doesn't work, it just WILL NOT work under any circumstances. But dS kidfic, written well? Makes me very happy. (And...hee. Yay. Let's hope.)

another ridiculously long comment

[joandarck.livejournal.com]

You know what, I think of myself as not wanting to read kidfic, just as I don't want to watch movies with kids in them - I resent the cutesiness, the limitations it places on the story, the simplistic, predictable dialogue, and the blatancy of the emotional hook. (I love books from children's points of view, but that's different.)

But there are exceptions - Aliens has a kid in it, and it drives the story instead of limiting it, and the emotional hook makes perfect sense in a survival setting, and it's, okay, a little cutesy, but I enjoy it.

Due South is the only fandom where I've liked kidfic. It still makes me uncomfortable, the hook is too overt or something, so I don't tend to reread it, but I do like it at the time, kind of like cuteoverload.com (http://cuteoverload.com/).

I think partly because Due South is for me in a lot of ways a, um, fix-it fandom? So to speak? I don't just want to read dS slash because I want validation of the subtext or because it's hot - I want it because I want someone to love Fraser and make it all better, and give him a chance to open up. And I want Ray to get his emotional security and have his big crush pay off. I can imagine them both wanting a long-term, secure, domestic, spouse-and-family situation, that creates something for the future, and raising kids sort of pings at that. (Oh god! grandkid fic! is there any?!)

(see, and I sort of love that idea - them as handsome old men, holding hands in the park, generations of their loving family around them, standing up at their kids' weddings - one gives the bride away and the other makes the toast, maybe? - framed photos on the mantlepiece - grandkids asking for stories or playing frisbee at the barbeque or - and at the same time I feel a little sick. cuteoverload!)

It's also a realistic setting for both their teamwork and their friction to play out, with lower stakes than crime-fighting - of course mom and dad argue but they still love each other, right? Or something. And also it's just easy to picture both of them dealing with children, in their different, but extremely cute, ways.

I don't know if any of those are the real answer. There's just something instinctive going on. When I look around at my other fandoms (Blakes 7, Professionals, LOTR, LOTRips, Sentinel, Farscape), the idea of kidfic is always somewhere between boring and threatening. It's easy to say it would be OOC for some of the characters to want kids - or that it would soften them to the point where they're no longer interesting - but mainly I just don't want some little burden taking screen time away from what I really want worked out, the relationship between the adults.

So why F/K kidfic? I guess something about F/K feels like it could be worked out through having kids? Going around in circles, giving up... now.

Re: another ridiculously long comment

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

Ohhhh, that makes a lot of sense. If there's just too much cutesiness, I can't take it. I think that dS is the only fandom I will ever like kidfic in, mostly because their circumstances - staying together - tend to allow for that. And it's nice to think of them not being totally alone and isolated up north somewhere, if that makes sense. You said it:

I can imagine them both wanting a long-term, secure, domestic, spouse-and-family situation, that creates something for the future, and raising kids sort of pings at that.

Precisely. (And ditto also to the emotional payoffs for both Ray and Fraser. Oh, it just gets me where it hurts.)

It's also a realistic setting for both their teamwork and their friction to play out, with lower stakes than crime-fighting - of course mom and dad argue but they still love each other, right? Or something.

Yep, makes sense to me. They have such a wonderful, interesting dynamic - they're not perfectly amiable, they bicker, but they clearly love each other, and are willing to work for it - that them having a kid/kids could work out, in the fantasy of them as real people, so to speak, and in fanfic.

So, yeah. F/K kidfic is the only kind that's worked for me so far. Then again, I've only been in two fandoms and have only had two OTPs. *g*

[shayheyred.livejournal.com]

Don't like kids in life or in fic. Even well written kidfic stories ("With Six You Get Eggroll" comes to mind) will never be in my all-time favorites column, even if I enjoy them. And while I'm tolerant of some of my friends' kids, or even the occasional cute precocious darling, in general kids are a subgroup I take great pains to avoid.
Usually.
But there are of course exceptions. Who was it who wrote that series of stories about Fraser and Ray K adopting a kid, that followed her as she grew up? pearl_o, was it? The stories were from the girl's perspective, and the were just superb. So, see, I'm not inflexible. Just very, very hard to please.

Hey! Who let that ankle biter in here? Get away from me, spawn of Satan!

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

kasjdkjasdasdkla

Oh, Shay. I totally understand that perspective. (And yes, it's Pearl's, and wonderful. I really like that arc.)

It definitely wasn't me! Me having kids in RL? EEEK. Probably not. Who knows. But definitely not for a WHILE.

[malnpudl.livejournal.com]

Afterthought:

While I most often avoid kidfics, there's one major exception.

I love stories that do a good job of looking at the childhood or youth of the adult characters that I know and love. Give me RayK in junior high school or Fraser at sixteen and I will be a very happy reader... assuming, of course, that it's well written and the characterization is good. Give me Joe and Billy in high school (and do a good job of it) and I'll be delerious with joy.

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

I love stories that do a good job of looking at the childhood or youth of the adult characters that I know and love.

YES. "Teeth of the Hydra" comes to mind, actually. Although, you know, I have very set ideas of what I think certain characters were like when they were kids, and it's hard to think differently, but a good writer can sell me. And, oh God... HCL HS fics. DAMN. Now I want some, badly.

[shihadchick.livejournal.com]

I tend to fall sort of in the middle - I don't want kids, never have, and while they're okay at times - like Isis said, I'm more than happy for them to go home shortly thereafter. I have a very hard time dealing with people who can't communicate with me, etc. So, yeah. Which tends to mean that I don't seek out the kidfic stuff much, though some of them (like that one where Ray had two kids with Stella and then she died and it starts out with them fixing the swing set up in the back yard? i love that. so much so, er, that i've lost the title and link. but i digress!) are really, really good and I totally dig those. And as such, can't wait to see yours. *happy wriggle of glee* But, yeah, it has to be done in character and smartly and not just be all "ooh adorable child BLAH"-y or anything. And, like other people have said - kids acting like real kids is a big plus. Seems like dS and SGA are pretty much the two fandoms where I can buy into and like (when done well) the kidfic, though having said that, I have a huge weakness for, like, HS!AUs and fics where the characters are turned into kids (especially if they've still got their memories etc) and... yeah. So, yeah, it's very dependant for me.

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

Damn, I want that link! :( (Also, it sounds like somebody took the premise from "Flower and Garnet". Heh.)

And yeah, I agree on it being dependent on fandoms and pairings and DAMN, I'm running to work, but YEAH. Also, HS!AUs - I wish there were more of them! I kind of...have a weakness for them, too. *g*

*HUGS just because*

[airinshaw.livejournal.com]

I also loathed kid!fic in HP - but then I also disliked AU in HP. Now I love AU. Good AU? Can't get enough (BTW - rec me some!)

Anyway - I have read some amazing kid!fic in SGA and dS. I think it really depends on the writer and the fandom. And the premise.

I like your kid!fic too - I'm so glad you're writing more!

[mrsronweasley.livejournal.com]

Haha, ditto, ditto, ditto. And I will try! Maybe this weekend? I will do my best. *g*

And, awww, thank you.

MWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

OMG CON.TXT!!

[floriatosca.livejournal.com]

If the kids in question are Ray Kowalski's, and everything else is well-executed, then I really like kidfic. There's just something appealing to me about RayK getting a chance to be a dad. Due South is also a show where the main characters' family relationships have some importance in canon, so dS kidfic is, in a way, working with elements already present in the text and therefore seems to fit in the fictional universe better than it would for a show more exclusively focused on homoerotic crimefighting.
There's also all sorts of potential amusement if it turns out that the Kowalski-Fraser brood can interact with dead!Bob.

Kidfic's not really practical in most of my other fandoms, although a few Hard Core Logo authors have done something with Billie.